Someone please convince me that being the nice guy is worth it.

[AdamP72]

With regard to women, dating, relationships, being the nice, caring guy has simply not served me well at all. What I’ve always gotten in return is punishment & pain. It’s just not worth it. At this point, I’d rather just be the typical asshole. Seems to be what women are used to, and what they’re looking for even though they aren’t consciously aware of it. The proof is in the pudding. Being an asshole has got to be a hell of a lot easier & they seem to make out much better on the dating scene.

This has been an extremely long time coming. Many years. Monday night & last night were simply the straws that broke the camel’s back.

Just turned a girl down for a date for these very reasons, and I told her so. The ability & desire to trust women in a romantic sense have simply been beaten out of me.

 

[Dororih]

As a woman whose bf has told me similar things before, I admit that I am wrong and I am making changes. At the root cause of it, I have fundamental issues (BDP-like symptoms for example), damaged childhoods, been thru toxic relationships.

These are not valid excuses but it's important I deal with them. And the women you hang with, I would think they might have similar issues but have not dealt with them.

On the other hand, I always fare better with a man who sets boundaries and is firm with me. Women do crazy things for attention, love, to feel desired etc. The more you let them beat you down, the further they will push the line to see "how much this man loves me". But they have to wake up their idea and see that there are other ways to receive love, other more intense/fulfilling/beautiful ways that sustain and grow each other.

Without the specifics, i can't comment on the women you have been with but I suspect their childhood/mental health has smth to do with it. Women are human too, and we are all a combination of our genetics + environment growing up. I suspect that largely their bad behavior towards you stems from hurt/fear/anxiety/insecurity etc

 

[CrazyAndy]

On the other hand, I always fare better with a man who sets boundaries and is firm with me.

This is true. I always approach relationships with women as if she were a child who needs to be disciplined and scolded occasionally.

 

[Dororih]

I quote the following from Quora (link below)
How to tell the difference between real love and BPD attachment - Quora)

"See, the thing about BPD pattern of emotional mind is that it craves unconditional acceptance that the sufferer never found as a child. Ergo, you have an adult looking for a parent in a lover. Therefore, subconsciously one is looking for someone to idealize, mate and demand unconditional affection (+ care taking) from."

Hence, I believe you are exactly right, she is behaving like a child towards you and unfort handling her as if she were a child helps her...until she becomes more conscious of her thoughts and behavior. Although, I still do wish to be lightly disciplined for the rest of my life, should I ever slip up and close control.

 

[AdamP72]

I do sincerely appreciate everyone’s responses so far. Frankly, I’m too upset & angry right now to be able to post anything even remotely positive or constructive. Sad but true. So for now the best thing for me to do is keep my thoughts to myself & just listen to others.

 

[Dororih]

I do sincerely appreciate everyone’s responses so far. Frankly, I’m too upset & angry right now to be able to post anything even remotely positive or constructive. Sad but true. So for now the best thing for me to do is keep my thoughts to myself & just listen to others.

I completely understand. With these scenarios, understanding the girl is one thing but she has to take it incredibly seriously and work to make it up to you (not in an offering you sex/being cute/buying you gifts etc way), but working to change herself from the inside out (her mind/heart), becoming a more positive person, and developing much more empathy. And of course the other flirty, cute, pampering stuff will help to sweeten the deal in getting you back.

It sounds like you're a really nice guy who got taken advantage of by mentally unstable girls. Hope you get some respite and healthy & positive energy from healthy people worth hanging around with, and focus on your own life/needs now cause ultimately you are the most impt and you come first

 

[EstherRose94]

ARP just be you! Being sweet is amazing and it’s valued. I would not fare too well with a guy who thought I was a child in need of scolding. No offense to crazyandy but I wouldn’t accept that. Two adults, two equals, in a loving relationship with respect and love and hopefully a bunch of sweetness is what I think a healthy relationship would look like.

 

[AdamP72]

ARP just be you! Being sweet is amazing and it’s valued. I would not fare too well with a guy who thought I was a child in need of scolding. No offense to crazyandy but I wouldn’t accept that. Two adults, two equals, in a loving relationship with respect and love and hopefully a bunch of sweetness is what I think a healthy relationship would look like.

Completely agree, on every level. Very grateful for your response.

 

[AdamP72]

Just to make the conversation a little more interesting, and to provide a bit more context in terms of my decision/feelings about the relationship thing. I posted this yesterday on another forum. Thought I’d post it here too. At the moment, details aren’t important. What’s key is that the girl in the situation wasn’t the would-be killer. It was a person whom she let into the house while I was there. True story.

“I’m thrilled & lucky to be alive. I went through a traumatic experience on Monday night. I could so easily have been killed. One single domino in this situation falls the wrong way, and I’m gone.

Not killed as in an accident. Killed as in murdered. I stared death squarely in the face & I was honestly preparing to die.”

A huge part of why this whole trust-erosion process finally came to a conclusion yesterday.

 

[CrazyAndy]

ARP just be you! Being sweet is amazing and it’s valued. I would not fare too well with a guy who thought I was a child in need of scolding. No offense to crazyandy but I wouldn’t accept that. Two adults, two equals, in a loving relationship with respect and love and hopefully a bunch of sweetness is what I think a healthy relationship would look like.

In theory, yes it's supposed to be like that. But most women I've been with have limited emotional maturity. Don't get me wrong, women are great and I love them. But most girls have a huge problem of mistaking kindness for weakness. They need to believe that their man is capable of managing them and controlling them as required. This is possibly the source of ARP's problems - he was being nice and reaped the 'benefits' that being nice gives.

 

[EstherRose94]

That just took the craziest turn ever. And is now way out of my expertise but i feel like maybe your dating game isn’t the most time sensitive of your problems atm?

@andy I guess Idk specifics of what every woman would prefer. I’d like my guy to be decisive and confident enough to protect me but not to manage me. I would want acceptance over judgment for sure. But I know I’m like describing an ideal and you’re describing your experience.

 

[Ramson mash]

In theory, yes it's supposed to be like that. But most women I've been with have limited emotional maturity. Don't get me wrong, women are great and I love them. But most girls have a huge problem of mistaking kindness for weakness. They need to believe that their man is capable of managing them and controlling them as required. This is possibly the source of ARP's problems - he was being nice and reaped the 'benefits' that being nice gives.

I disagree on the whole. But if it were true about most women it would still be your responsibility to avoid those types. emotional immaturity is something which will be worked on through the relationship with both people and no one says that when you reach this supposed maturity that you are any happier for it.

 

[AdamP72]

That just took the craziest turn ever. And is now way out of my expertise but i feel like maybe your dating game isn’t the most time sensitive of your problems atm?

You are sooo correct. The dating game just got demoted to last place. There are much more important things going on, to be sure.

 

[EstherRose94]

Are you safe now, in all seriousness?

 

[AnxiousE]

Ok, so knowing more of the story...sounds like you just met the wrong person at the wrong time. The other experiences you've had to get up to this point, maybe those were all jerks too. I mean, I don't know where you're from. Maybe you need to go somewhere else...
Or Maybe I actually did hit the lottery with my husband. I do trust him. He's a real decent person. But at the same time, I find it hard to share some of my most honest feelings, so in that sense, I have a hard time with trust. So nobody's perfect! Oh, but like I said, he's decent, so the "nice guy", and I fell hard for that. It's a nice change from the selfish jerks out there. So I guess my argument is that there has to be others out there like me that actually like the nice guy. And you should be nice just for you! You'll at least feel better about yourself (hopefully) in that you're doing the right thing. And it might attract more female friends (I know you're looking for more but hear me out), but those friendships might just turn into more. I dunno. I just feel strongly about you not giving up. Nice guys are a rare find and should be more appreciated in our culture.