Poor Treament

cpuusage

cpuusage

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
37,660
Location
Planet Lunatic Asylum
#1
i don't agree with the current mainstream / dominant understanding & approach to psychosis / schizophrenia.

i don't agree with a lot of the past 27 years of ways that i have been treated.

Surely with what i have spoken out on in my criticism of things, & in of alternatives is Not unreasonable? Nor irrational.

A lot of the treatment is crap.
 
I

itsmeagain

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 25, 2010
Messages
578
Location
england
#2
In what way can treatment be improved ?
Why do the huge majority go along with the biological paradigm?
Is it due to for instance, knowledge that the 10mg olanzapine makes a man feel better?
Sitting talking to a therapist, though being as rare as hens teeth, is not particularly comforting for some.
There is a dire need for humanity in the system as it is a callous mess .
However often the so called alternatives seem non existent.
I know about some but the mass of inpatients and outpatients, not to mention frontline staff, do not.
 
Poopy Doll

Poopy Doll

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 13, 2015
Messages
11,501
Location
Fort Lauderdale, Florida, USA
#4
As I've said before, I went looking for Carl Jung and was drugged instead. In all fairness, like many people of my generation, the idea of a magic pill appealed to me.

The system needs to be improved but apparently it's run by fallible human beings and the human beings aren't getting any better.
 
P

Pixieb34

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2016
Messages
201
Location
England
#5
Meds are given out at doses that are far too high. I'm better on the lowest dose. I think they just want us so sedated we cannot be a danger. Apparently, most schizophrenics have suffered a serious trauma in life, like abuse. Meds won't address that. They don't even know how the Meds work or the long term effects of the newer generation. It's a worry.
 
Mayflower7

Mayflower7

Well-known member
Moderator
Joined
Jan 4, 2013
Messages
8,792
Location
England
#6
Meds are given out at doses that are far too high. I'm better on the lowest dose. I think they just want us so sedated we cannot be a danger. Apparently, most schizophrenics have suffered a serious trauma in life, like abuse. Meds won't address that. They don't even know how the Meds work or the long term effects of the newer generation. It's a worry.
Hi,
I agree that meds are been given at far too high doses. There was a patient at my depot clinic that had an obvious movement disorder. It was such a shame.
I worry about the long term effects as well.
Treatment needs to change as does the discrimination.
Take care
 
BorderlineDownunder

BorderlineDownunder

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 23, 2015
Messages
17,146
#7
Meds are given out at doses that are far too high. I'm better on the lowest dose. I think they just want us so sedated we cannot be a danger. Apparently, most schizophrenics have suffered a serious trauma in life, like abuse. Meds won't address that. They don't even know how the Meds work or the long term effects of the newer generation. It's a worry.
actually the newest research implies schizophrenia is developed in the womb much like spina bifida.

And like spina bifida, its a vitamin deficiency in the mother.
 
I

itsmeagain

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 25, 2010
Messages
578
Location
england
#8
Are you joking? Has Nothing that i've posted for the past 12 years made any sense to you, or do you just see it all as nonsense?



There are a lot of reasons i think for it all. Doesn't make it right.
I meant how do we go about actually improving care?
 
cpuusage

cpuusage

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
37,660
Location
Planet Lunatic Asylum
#10
i suppose what i have always gone on about; as i see it is 2 fold -

That for a genuine shift to a far better World / Society / Culture / Civilisation requires a fundamental Global systemic shift, especially within & away from the current economic, political & exoteric religious system / paradigm. i'm all in favour of the Model / Vision of the Zeitgeist Movement / Venus Project & associated areas.

Within areas of mental health i think that there are myriad viable alternative models & approaches to treatment, that are very well evidenced, & that focus on far more humane & comprehensive understandings & approaches.

How can all that be implemented? i don't know, as there is very violent opposition to & very powerful forces & agendas opposing both potential solutions.
 
Last edited:
cpuusage

cpuusage

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
37,660
Location
Planet Lunatic Asylum
#11
i suppose what i have always gone on about; as i see it is 2 fold -

That for a genuine shift to a far better World / Society / Culture / Civilisation requires a fundamental Global systemic shift, especially within & away from the current economic, political & exoteric religious system / paradigm. i'm all in favour of the Model / Vision of the Zeitgeist Movement / Venus Project & associated areas.

Within areas of mental health i think that there are myriad viable alternative models & approaches to treatment, that are very well evidenced, & that focus on far more humane & comprehensive understandings & approaches.

How can all that be implemented? i don't know, as there is very violent opposition to & very powerful forces & agendas opposing both potential solutions.
There is an aspect of Global Civilisation / Evolution, that it does often precipitate major shifts - we had the agricultural & industrial revolutions. We had the renaissance & enlightenment. We had a major shift some 70,000 years ago into the Shamanic & a far more advanced form of collective consciousness. A lot of areas are also dependent on historical interpretations - there was a major shift within human civilisation just after the last ice age.

It is possible that Global Civilisation is on the verge of another shift, a meta-paradigm shift, but very possibly in certain ways that can't be fully envisioned until after it has happened, as these things generally go. Time will tell with it all as to what transpires. It may also be the case that what transpires is different for different people, within a number of potential scenarios.
 
pepecat

pepecat

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 19, 2010
Messages
13,739
Location
middle earth
#15
I think society has always moved in phases. Not just the 'biggies' like the industrial revolution or enlightenment, but modernity and then post modernity* regarding the cultural and ecomonic state of the nation in the twentieth century, and then now we're in a so called post-truth phase - post-postmodernity??

I think through the C20 in this country there's been a strong paternal element to the state - post war, free healthcare etc, education was free gradually over the twentieth century and school leaving ages were raised as the state 'told' people it's better for kids to get educated for longer, welfare and all those benefits. The benevolent state looking after the citizens. Good if done properly, of course, but it can be overbearing at times, and especially if you start tying it with elite theory and who has the power. I think given that for several decades people have looked to the state to look after them, it's not really suprising that people still look to the NHS (and the 'medical model') for help and support. It's almost in our psyche as a nation. Get sick? The NHS will sort you out for free. Become unemployed? There are benefits. Retire? There's a pension.
As I say, good when done properly, and in comparison with a lot of countries, we're very lucky.
But it's not good when paternalism then starts dictating what treatment is 'right' for everyone or excluding potential alternatives.
I wonder if countries that have a less comprehensive / insurance based healthcare system have more alternative treatments on offer? In those situations it becomes a marketplace, if someone's willing to pay for it, it can be provided. Here, if the state don't quite approve, it doesn't happen.

*or moderism and post-modernism if you're looking at literature / art / criticism
 
F

firemonkee57

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 23, 2009
Messages
8,207
#16
A lot of the treatment is crap.
For me a lot of that is down to a lack of a whole person approach, and the all too frequent tendency of mental health professionals to rush to judgement without asking,listening and learning first. A lot of the latter comes down to arrogance on the part of the mental health professional.
 
F

firemonkee57

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 23, 2009
Messages
8,207
#17
Hi,
I agree that meds are been given at far too high doses.
I think this was more true in the 70s and 80s . I remember when I was first put on APs with nothing for the side effects. I was like a zombie with an acute case of akathisia. It did sod all to make me feel better.
 
cpuusage

cpuusage

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
37,660
Location
Planet Lunatic Asylum
#18
For me a lot of that is down to a lack of a whole person approach, and the all too frequent tendency of mental health professionals to rush to judgement without asking,listening and learning first. A lot of the latter comes down to arrogance on the part of the mental health professional.
i don't know? i think that everyone is playing a part now in how everything is. i agree that there needs to be a whole person approach, but as you know the Model i would use is integral / holistic - mind, body, soul, spirit & environment - integrated biological, psychological, sociological & spiritual / transpersonal areas. We're a long way off anything like that being universally introduced & applied, if anything like it ever is?

i have found that anything that is more comprehensive / alternative / critical of the current system always seems to run into a lot of arguments & polemics. & again i don't know if that will ever be fully resolved?

How & if things ever genuinely change from a primary biomedical focus is anyone's guess? i'm Not sure that many people even understand all the different arguments that people have made & are making? A lot of people now don't seem to even understand what the existing / current biomedical system / paradigm is & means? So what hope?
 
F

firemonkee57

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 23, 2009
Messages
8,207
#19
Many of us are a lot brighter than you give us credit for. We realise the system is imperfect and needs improvement, even if intellectually we depart from you to varying degrees.
 
BorderlineDownunder

BorderlineDownunder

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 23, 2015
Messages
17,146
#20
i don't know? i think that everyone is playing a part now in how everything is. i agree that there needs to be a whole person approach, but as you know the Model i would use is integral / holistic - mind, body, soul, spirit & environment - integrated biological, psychological, sociological & spiritual / transpersonal areas. We're a long way off anything like that being universally introduced & applied, if anything like it ever is?

i have found that anything that is more comprehensive / alternative / critical of the current system always seems to run into a lot of arguments & polemics. & again i don't know if that will ever be fully resolved?

How & if things ever genuinely change from a primary biomedical focus is anyone's guess? i'm Not sure that many people even understand all the different arguments that people have made & are making? A lot of people now don't seem to even understand what the existing / current biomedical system / paradigm is & means? So what hope?

A bad teacher blames his students.