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Genetics.

M

maudikie

Guest
There is news about a genetic component of schizophrenia which can be found on Medical Nes today. Dial in schizophrenia on their site.
 
R

rasselas

Guest
...

how can an abstract diagnosis (which depends as much on the person making it as it does on the person receiving it) have a genetic component?

how about the genetic component for losing a sock, looking under your bed, thinking of your grandma, and thinking you heard a wolf howl... then banging your head and requiring a paracetamol? i'll call this sock-o-phrenia... now, let's find the genes...
 
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rasselas

Guest
...

can i just add... in all seriousness... if you think you may have sock-o-phrenia... please... please i beg you seek professonal psychiatric help...
 
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IntrospectionFtw!

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I read somewhere thats it very unlikely that one gene is responsible for every variable of psychosis... if that makes sense sorry not that switched on right now.
 
R

rasselas

Guest
...

the possibility of a genetic basis of psychosis remains where it began: at the intellectual level of debate...

this, despite what you may read, is a philosophical debate...

you have to know really is that the opportunities for social influence and research funding are very limited to philosophy...

if you abandon the terms psychosis and schizophrenia and just try and compare like for like... in the same sense that 'real' doctors do... for instance, compare diabetes like for like, or compare parkinsons disease like for like... the divergence will be minimal, there will be some, naturaly, but it will be minimal...

now, lets compare people diagnosed with or experiencing so called schizophrenia/psychosis, let's do a like for like comparison.... what do we find?

a massive divergence, almsot an impossibility of like for like... psychiatrists overcome this with the DSM bible of human personality types... and with schizophrenia they have their cluster lists... and cluster lists for all the diagnoses...

and how specific are they?

they are generalised... non-specific...

in the next DSM they are propsoing to widen the critera for schizophrenia

basically, we will have more schizophrenics after DSM V...

there are people out there now.. they are not yet aware of it...

and psychiatrists are not yet aware of it...

they are schizophrenics in waiting....

i know this is all difficult... but you either submit to this abuse of power - you either submit to this violence... and this obscene reduction of the human soul... or you buy into it... you victimise yourself to it... and i know its not as straightforward as that... my lord, i know that only too well... but there is really only one route to recovery that i can see... and that's to fight against this reductionism... to learn why these alleged facts are lies... to learn why this science is a pseudo-science... fight for your self... AND IN THAT FIGHT YOU WILL FIND YOUR SELF...

but of course, psychiatry is the new faith...

and to challenge a faith is the ultimate taboo... for when a faith has taken hold of a culture... those that subvert that faith are considered heathens, evil almost.... it is a heresy!

and of course , you see that...

for just as bush would say that those who opposed his tyranny were anti-american...

so too the tyranny of psychiatry has their word for thsoe that oppose them..

they call them: anti-psychiatry...

and words are power... they contain us.. they direct us... just feel the arrogance and tyranny in that word... anti-psychiatry... look at how its bandied about... just like the with-hunts and the inquisitions of old...

WE ARE NOT GENETEC FREAKS

WE ARE THE CONSEQUENCE OF LIFE!
 
A

antipsionic

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Oct 31, 2009
Messages
155
Just my two pence on the subject.

Considering that Schizophrenia is probably an umbrella term for a number of widely differing conditions that show similar symptoms and that some of these conditions run in families there is probably a genetic basis for some of the conditions that are labeled as Schizophrenia.

However I've come across people who have no family history of mental illness who have also acquired this label through drug abuse, head injury or just over exposure to highly stressful situations.

The fact is right now Psychiatry is more art than science, why some drugs work on some people with similar labels and have no effect on others with the same diagnosis pretty much demonstrates this conclusively to me.

However until the invention of antibiotics there wasn't really an effective way to treat an infected wound except amputation, so I do hold out hope of someday there being an effective treatment that isn't the pharmacological equivalent of using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
 
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IntrospectionFtw!

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Also i dont think its a neuro degenarative disease and i really dont know how they've got away with claiming it is without any proof brain shrinkage etc...
thats the problem really theres so many theorys and people are just believing them and basing there whole treatment on it, forgeting that there just theorys. mental illness is one stigma prejudice that wont go away and i truthfully believe were being fucked over it is really that bad we're placed about as low as murderers in the social hierarchy...so there happy to drug us up with shitty drugs that dont work and shut up the small minority and feed us there false propaganda...

definatly rambling today...

i actually used to be smart you know...shoulda posted on here a year ago woulda had more insights.
 
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M

maudikie

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Maudikie

I think that everyone is different, (Thank goodness). But if the difference is so great that it makes them ill, then every track should be explored in order to - not make them lke everyone else, but so that they fit in with all the other different people. And also that they get a good quality of life.If someone is born or acquires a disability then other people should accept it, and do what they can to make life easier for the disabled person. This is just as true of psychiatry. Psychiatists and psychiatric nurses, and other members of the psychiatric team are there as mediators to ease the troubled mind which so often afflicts a person with schizophrenia. The brain is an organ, just as the stomach, liver, kidneys etc. So if it has some dysfunction it is (in my opinion) the duty of others to ease whatever is wrong with it. Genetics are not a cure, but they do help with understanding.
 
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maudikie

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Maudikie.

It's my washing machine that has sockomania!
Seriously - genetics is a very complicated study, and to find a gene for schzophrenia shoudl be a great help for the future.
 
M

Meshuggah

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It's my washing machine that has sockomania!
Seriously - genetics is a very complicated study, and to find a gene for schzophrenia shoudl be a great help for the future.
I think that they first theorised that schizophrenia had a genetic component about 80 years ago. And they are still yet to find any convincing evidence. For the past thirty years intensive research into schizophrenia genes have failed to find anything that is consistent across studies. There is also no sufficient evidence to suggest it is either a brain disease or a chemical imbalance.

I think that psychological and social factors play a far bigger role than any biological ones.
 
D

diddypinks

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I KNOW its genetic my grandad was a very suspicious person and a schizophrenic he always thought people were against him stealing from him breaking into his house my dad is "eccentric" and out of three girls i am the middle child who has enherited that gene. my grandad and i share EXACTLY the same symptoms fear of the police people breaking in and beingg spied upon. i will be there for and make sure that my neice and nephew do not smoke cannabis.:eek:
 
S

*Sapphire*

Guest
I watched a programe about foetuses. At 12 weeks they develop hearing and are learning emotions through that sound. They are deeply affected by things going on inside and outside the womb which can affect their development even before they are born.

I am leaning so much more towards the nurture side of this debate. I think children/babies are little sponges, it is up to us to try and ensure as adults what they do and don't soak up. But it is not always within our means.
 
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Meshuggah

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In conjunction with a lack of scientific evidence I also find it impossible to believe that schizophrenia has a genetic or biological cause because my symptoms first started after I decided to devote myself to a particular religion with far more intensity and for far longer periods (often in isolation) than I ever did before. I never heard voices as in hearing a sound that seemed to come from somewhere external, but I did begin to believe that I could communicate with spiritual beings and other people through my thoughts and believed that I was getting answers back from numerous beings that seemed to have personalities separate from my own. During certain periods I believed that I could talk to the entire world at once, which became extremely frustrating when I began to think that my thoughts were out of control and people could read anything I was thinking. I also thought that due to the influence of my psychic powers I was influencing all sorts of external events. Another thing I believed was that I could predict certain things that were going to happen or had happened.

My problems ended when I began to find that despite the fact that I was getting answers back (or believed I was - even now I still believe I can get answers back - whatever the hell is replying though I don't know what -possibly some sort of mental reflection or perception of myself) so many of the things I was being told were total garbage. For instance at one point I'd predicted that someone who had gotten sick of listening to my psychic powers had planted a bomb under my car and was intent on killing me, but this proved to be wrong. The so-called spiritual beings were also in many ways inconsistent and contradictory with their answers so I stopped asking for advice because it wasn't helpful to me. They would also sometimes change between being pleasant in nature, which they were most of the time, to being unpleasant. I also started testing out my apparent psychic powers in social situations and looked for alternative explanations as to why I thought changes in other people's behaviour was affected by my thoughts. In some cases I came to think it was probably more to do with the fact that I was acting differently in terms of my physical behaviour whilst reacting to and using my thought processes and that this external physical behaviour was what caused changes in the behaviour of others. In most cases though, I was probably just looking at normal human behaviour and somehow justifying other people's actions in ways that fit into my theory that I could communicate with my mind.

I no longer believe I have psychic or predictive powers and it was mainly the fact that I thought I had uncontrollable psychic powers and that people could read my thoughts that had made me start to become very paranoid during one of my "episodes". My predictions about things had also been causing me trouble so without these two factors most of my problems were pretty much over. I still have religious beliefs but I'm no longer committing myself to certain apsects with the same intensity and instead of trying to get answers from spiritual beings I'm using my own judgements to make decisions. I've been off medication for several months now and to my friends and family I'm no different to the way I was prior to my diagnoses.

I'm sorry if I shouldn't have written such a long story about my personal experiences under a thread about genetics but its an explanation for some of the reasons that I refute the genetics theory. I don't believe that genes or biological factors can explain why these experiences happened to me and I don't believe that it is a chronic condition.
 
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M

Meshuggah

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Btw, I'm not suggesting that people should go off medication because I did a lot of self-reflection and analysis and read a lot about alternative mental health ideas before I stopped taking medication. I probably would have relapsed if I'd stopped taking medication much earlier.
I'm also not going to pretend that I've recovered because it's only been a few months that I've been without medication and I do a lot of talking to my sister and parents and have tried to help them come to an understanding of my experiences which has helped me a lot.
 
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