ESA venting / rant

dib4uk

dib4uk

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#21
That is the reason why its important to go along to the relative organisations in your area that can help you.

At least with someone there they can actuarly act on your behalf- the reason why the dsecriptors are put that way is to make sure that you score 0.
 
DiagnosisBipolar2

DiagnosisBipolar2

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#22
Hi Gray,
Sorry to hear of your current position however do not delay in submitting your appeal. You can appeal before seeing the CAB/legal advisor etc. As you only need to provide basic info initially. You can add the full facts later when you have sought help.

If you do decide to lodge an appeal the most important thing is to do so within one month of the date on the decision letter. Get a copy of booklet GL24 If you think our decision is wrong,which explains the appeals process and also includes an appeal form to tear out and complete.You can get the booklet from your local DWP office, jobcentre or advice agency. You can alsodownload a copy from the DWP website.The appeal form asks you for:

• Your name and address
• Your date of birth
• Details of your representative if you have one – don’t worry if you’re not sure if you can
get one yet, their details can be given to the Tribunals Service at any time
• Your national insurance number
• The benefit you are appealing about – this will be ESA
• The date shown at the top of the letter telling you about the decision – this is to check if
your appeal is within the time limits
• Why you disagree with the decision (see below)
• Your signature and the date

If you can’t get a copy of the form then you should write a letter containing all the information above. But bear in mind that the DWP are not obliged to accept an appeal that is not on theproper form, so only do this as a last resort.

An example appeal:


I wish to appeal against the decision that I do not have limited capability for work. I consider that I provided enough evidence for a finding to be made that I do have limited capability for work [if you think you should be in the support group add the words ‘and limited capability for work-related activity].

I do not consider that the decision maker took full account of the severity of my condition or of the way that it affects my everyday activities and bodily functions.[If you wish, you can give an example of why you think the decision maker got it wrong, such as:For example, in my questionnaire I stated that because of my depression I usually cannot motivate myself to do everyday things like getting out of bed, washing, dressing or eating breakfast unless my partner repeatedly encourages me. Yet I was awarded no points for this.This is only one example of why I think the decision is wrong.]

Please do not ask me to provide further details of my grounds of appeal as I will not be able to do so until I have been provided with a full copy of the papers and had the opportunity to try to get independent advice and support.

If you wish to contact me about this please do so in writing. I do not wish to receive any telephone calls as I consider welfare benefits too complex to be discussed over the telephone.I wish to have an oral hearing so that I can explain the full effects of my condition to a tribunal and answer any questions they may wish to ask.

Whilst my appeal is being considered I wish to remain in the assessment phase of ESA
[ Don’t add the last sentence if you are intending to claim JSA instead]

If you do wish to continue to claim ESA at the assessment phase rate it would also be worth writing a separate letter to the office dealing with your claim explaining that you have now made a formal appeal and wish to carry on claiming ESA.
 
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gray

gray

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#23
That example appeal is very helpful, thank you.

This bit in particular:
you can give an example of why you think the decision maker got it wrong, such as:For example, in my questionnaire I stated that because of my depression I usually cannot motivate myself to do everyday things like getting out of bed, washing, dressing or eating breakfast unless my partner repeatedly encourages me. Yet I was awarded no points for this.This is only one example of why I think the decision is wrong.
For starters it is irrefutable that they did not pay any attention to my questionnaire whatsoever, it has been completely ignored. Yet the decision says that my score has been decided on both the medical report and the questionnaire. It is so easy to see that someone in the office has just took one look at the medical report score of 0 and then hit their button for fail.

Like my previous example, how can you possibly read "no problems with social interaction" and "Interaction with others is misinterpreted most days leading to mental anguish for the person" and then not think "hang on something is a miss here".

To top it off at one of those work related interviews (compulsory) a jobcentre employee told me that because I scored 0 on the medical, I will automatically fail and my questionnaire doesn't matter...

I'm starting to trickle through information on this forum about my case, believe me there is loads more, perhaps some of you can understand why I want to sue them.

Oh yes lets not forget the same jobcentre employee who also said "you're nothing new, you're just the new bad back".
 
gray

gray

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#24
Interaction with others is misinterpreted most days leading to mental anguish for the person

Is it just me or does the statement mean that d) applies to me and that I should have been awarded 9 points for this alone?
Also looking up the word anguish in the Oxford dictionary provides you with the definition of "severe mental or physical pain".

So again how the hell did I not recieve atleast 9 points for this alone? They really are a joke that I have to do all this crap. Has done nothing but stress me out, make my condition worse, make me more tired and I can't help but obsess over it :eek2:

The other day I was so obsessed with it I was writing stuff at 2am about it, I spent the following day doing nothing but think and worry about it and felt like I was going to pass out.
 
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DiagnosisBipolar2

DiagnosisBipolar2

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#25
It's very unfair Gray and is causing many people lots of uneeded hassle. You must appeal though and claim what you are entitled to. Try and stay positive and get that form sent off.
 
C

Chrissyangel

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#26
ESA

Hi yes I got zero points too,I was so shocked,and the doctor told lies,I think one mistake I did i plucked up the courage and went there myself,but I had no option as i never had anyone to come with me. Now I am feeling really down waiting for the appeal to come,the date,they put it will be between 6 and 12 weeks,and I have to say if I will be available or not available at this time,now I am worried as i go away for 25 days in 12 weeks time,hoping this break will help me in my depression,I also have chronic back pain,and at last a doctor is sending me for a scan. I am glad I found this forum,and now will try to get in touch with Mind,and go to CAB,I do hope they will have someone to come with me to the appeal,a friend said he would come but I am not sure if that would help or not,he has illness himself,hearing voices etc,although he believes they are real etc,I think maybe it wouldn't help my appeal really to take him along.I just hope I can get some help from someone. I even asked my doctor for letter,as girl from benefits said they should give you a letter,but I have asked two doctors and they said you dont need letter,and they will contact them before the appeal,is this right does anyone no please? Lets hope all will turn out for us all.Appreciate any help thanks Chrissy:confused:
 
dib4uk

dib4uk

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#27
Hey Chrissyangel- welcome to the null point (o) points page :D

Well the only advice I can give anyone is get the appeal in- Atos? are paid to fail 1 in 3 cases, thats the government remit- and after searching another website that deals with disabilities- i was not surprised to learn that they also recieved null points- ouch!

Chrissyangel- yes go along to Mind or the CAB- I opted for Mind- and they can represent you at the tribunal. I dont know how successful it has become-because thats where I am at the moment.

All I can say is the sooner you put it in the better it is for you. Even if you write them-DWP- a letter stating that you want an oral hearing at your tribunal and state that the findings are inncorrect because ...... thats what I did, and so to make sure they received it- i dont trust these people-so i also filled out the appeal forms that I got when I called up the benefit enquiry team.

As i'm a natural born cynic- something in me says that if successful with the tribunal then you will get the money that you're legally entitiled to- and the system is in place so people will not go to tribunal.

Good luck with your case Chrissyangel.

Gray I understand and I'm hearing you- but try not to procrastinate too much. It doesnt have to be that long the letter or on the form- just state that you wish to have an oral hearing. :clap:

I totally understand- it has made weeks and days unbearable, and sometimes suicidial- and when you go to the welfare benefit advice place they will also write to your psychiatrist for proff to help build your case.
 
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Napolean Today

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#29
I worry I might snap in that kind of setting. If I'd to spend the day with eight others looking for non-existent work it'd drive me to distraction. If any were hostile I can envisage me taking a knife in and getting into trouble. :tea:
 
R

ramboghettouk

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#30
i remember my namesake as far as the kids in my last area were concerned rambo ryan, who commited the humgerford massacre, he took a gun on one of the employment schemes he was on, having been on those schemes and having experienced the underlying violence i felt i could understand it
 
gray

gray

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#31
occasionally shops with father due to apathy
Oxford dictionary defines apathy as "lack of interest or enthusiasm". So this statement doesn't make any sense to me, can someone else make any sense out of it?

oh and just for reference... about 3 times a year = occasionally in the ATOS book of logic :rolleyes:
 
dib4uk

dib4uk

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#32
Sadly that is what Atos does- they fake things and lie because their contract is worth a lot of money, and their remit is to fail three people to every one successsful claimants, and so by doing that the social care benefit lowers- but the downside of that the unemployment benefit and the jobless figures rises.
 
gray

gray

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#33
Gray I understand and I'm hearing you- but try not to procrastinate too much.
You know, I didn't even notice this but it is quite significant. It is very clear that going back and looking at my life, I have a real problem with procrastination. It will be worth bringing up at my counselling that's for sure.

It does seem to explain a lot of my behaviour.
 
gray

gray

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#34
Sadly that is what Atos does- they fake things and lie because their contract is worth a lot of money, and their remit is to fail three people to every one successsful claimants, and so by doing that the social care benefit lowers- but the downside of that the unemployment benefit and the jobless figures rises.
I dunno the DWP have done a good job not bothering to read my questionnaire and also filling it with misleading questions with tick box answers that don't leave much room for telling it exactly.

e.g. the initiating and sustaining personal action question

Do you need encouragement from someone else to start and keep on with routine jobs?

  1. every day
  2. most the time
  3. not very often
  4. it varies
where's the "encouragement doesn't work" box? :confused:
 
dib4uk

dib4uk

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#35
I dunno the DWP have done a good job not bothering to read my questionnaire and also filling it with misleading questions with tick box answers that don't leave much room for telling it exactly.

e.g. the initiating and sustaining personal action question


where's the "encouragement doesn't work" box? :confused:
Well in that case tick everyday- where I went wrong i ticked it varies...

Yeah I believe from all that I've researched online and other forums its the way that ESA is put forward- so that most people would tick they have no problems...
 
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Nuttybutnice

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#36
Hello,

near the start of this month I had one of these ESA medicals, it seemed like the doctor was understanding but I felt I wasn't given the chance to fully explain things and I felt like it was rushed.

I recently requested a report and it came in the post today. I am baffled by it quite frankly.

According to the report I have mild depression and advice of a return to work in 3 months. However I have been scored 0 points by this doctor, how can I score no points and yet be seemingly deemed incapable of work for 3 months?
This is not the overall decision as that has yet to be made, but if I have been scored 0 points we all know where that leads...

Under "other conditions reported" it says "client states no other problems", this is false. I told the doctor I have anxiety issues and OCD, I tried to explain this a bit as well. I was told that these could be underlying issues due to the depression and that I should just leave talking about them for my counselling...

I have no problems with dressing apparantly (ok I don't physically), but I wear the same pair of shorts and t-shirt for a week or more before I change to different clothes. I hardly ever get dressed properly. This was all stated by myself.

I like to watch TV generally day time TV, strange really as I tend to not watch TV at all in the day and only watch it late at night, not sure where they got this one from.

I feed and care for my pet and occasionally walk it for 10 minutes... hhmm... that is why my dad feeds my dog basically every single time and why I generally only take my dog out about once every couple of months...

I have no problems travelling to new locations. Despite the fact I told them that if my dad didn't take me to the medical I wouldn't have showed up.

adequete eye contact... i remember spending most of my time staring at the floor and then getting anxious thinking i better look up before they think im a wierdo

I am well dressed and neatly kempt. Please... I shave my hair about once per 3-4 months and then let it grow again until it becomes unbareable (I have like excma and my head can get really itchy). I showed up with a bit of a beard which I still haven't shaved today actually. I wore a football top to the medical, same thing I do when I get dressed "properly" every time (doesn't need ironing) I wear baggy jeans (doesn't need ironing), see the trend? I wear whatever takes the least amount of effort. Though I was never given a chance to defend my self by stating any of this as they came to their conclusion mearly on thier observation.

This is one perticular thing which annoyed me greatly too, as I have said previously I wasn't given a chance to explain fully about anxiety / OCD etc. I have no reccurrent thoughts, complex sequences, internal debates, distressing repetitive thoughts etc etc... THIS IS COMPLETELY FALSE and they would have known that if I was allowed to explain things fully.

I don't experience depersonalisation (the feeling of being unreal) don't know how they came to that conclusion as I was never asked about this sort of thing. I do sometimes feel things like this and what's the point in life, am I real? does anything really matter?

sorry for the rant but i just had to vent, just rang up my dad in work and had a good moan too

oh and to top it all off they have made a very big mistake, I have a single sheet that is someones actual decision. Their name, NI number, date of birth, how many points they scored etc. What should I do about this? Hang on to it as a sign of DWPs own incompetence?
I had a capability test by atos in may for my IB, i have history of anxiety disorder and depression, i was awaiting formal diagnosis of bipolar at the time of the test which i told them, they failed me and my benefit was immediately stopped and i was virtually told to get a job, this left me suicidal and extremely distressed, thankfully my daughter still lives with me and without her i would certainly not be here now, i have appealed and await the date for that fiasco, i have today had the diagnosis of bipolar and been assigned a pyschiatrist and MH nurse at my local nhs mental health team, my test by the atos doctor was a fiasco, she made up her own answers to the questions, unsurprisingly she denies this and atos back her, i have complained to the gmc about her conduct and intend to pursue that as much as i can, the dwp told me my mental "disease" was mild, this situation has to be stopped, atos are merely intent on reducing claimants for the dwp who are in turn operating with questionable tactics/methods and motive. I think a campaign should be started to fight this situation, i am game if anyone else is, its no good doing it on my own.
 
dib4uk

dib4uk

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#37
Nuttybutnice I totally agree with you, I'm considering complaining to the DWP and my local mp and if i can take it further then I will do.

It is really rubbish how Atos can get away in doing that !

:mad:
 
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ramboghettouk

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#38
I've stopped worrying about them declaring me fit for work, i'm worrying about them saying i'm not as disabled as i say and adjusting the benefits down

LIke to think those who use the internet aren't a reliable sample for statistical purposes though i'm hearing stories from other people as well
 
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Nuttybutnice

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#39
well i really wouldnt put anything past them, from my own personal experience and the similar ones of many others it seems the most vulnerable are top of their hit list, i have my local MP enquiring further, the GMC taking a look at it, i also have just requested via the freedom of information act at the dwp for a list of complaints made about the medical centre i attended and any about the doctor i saw, i am not giving up on this. I wont be attending any further tests without someone with me and am making sure i have a welfare rights person with me at appeal.
 
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ramboghettouk

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#40
If your fit enough to fight your case your fit enough to work, i guess thats their take on mental illness and if you really are mentally ill well your complaint is probably due to the illness, catch 22 as they call it