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    Thread: Do Rebels Who Defy Treatment Do Better? (“non-compliance” often saves us)

    1. #1
      Apotheosis
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      Default Do Rebels Who Defy Treatment Do Better? (“non-compliance” often saves us)

      Thanks Starless gave thanks for this post

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      Senior Member Raina Walks's Avatar
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      good post ...thanks for sharing...

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      Default Do rebels who defy treatment do better?

      It depends on the illness. Schizophrenia may be short lived or may be long term. If it is long term and well treated by medication it can be dangerous to defy its necessity. Unfortunately there are too few psychiatrists and psychiatric beds for people to be admitted for observation. If some one has a diagnosis of a long-term mental condition which can be treated by medicationit is dangerous not to have it, as stopping taking it may lead to further breakdown. The dose should be at the smallest level for each patient's needs, their physical condition should be examined on a regular basis (6 - 12 month) If they are getting bad side effects they should ask for an urgent appointment with their G.P. or psychiatrist. If they are with family their family may notice a deterioration in their condition and whilst they are well it is advisable to give the family, partner, friends, permission to seek help on their behalf.

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      Super Moderator pepecat's Avatar
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      This article: http://beyondmeds.com/emptypsychbeds/ (a link in one of the ones you posted) Apo, was brilliant. Why can't we try some of that here?
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    5. #5
      Apotheosis
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      Quote Originally Posted by pepecat View Post
      Why can't we try some of that here?
      It's beyond me why there isn't proper psychological/social support for people. I suppose that the majority don't want it?

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      Super Moderator pepecat's Avatar
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      D'you think that's common for people with mental health issues (i don't like the term 'illness' - sorry....). What i mean is (i think), are people here in the UK wanting psychological / social support and not getting it cos of money / the way healthcare here is set up, or are they not wanting it DUE to the way the healthcare system is set up (medical model)?
      Or not wanting it cos they want a 'quick' (easy) fix? Or beacuse they don't want to spend time and effort examining themselves with a therapist?

      I'm not sure that makes sense actually.... in simpler terms - why do you think people don't want psychological support?

      There, that's better..... :P
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    7. #7
      Apotheosis
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      Quote Originally Posted by pepecat View Post
      D'you think that's common for people with mental health issues (i don't like the term 'illness' - sorry....). What i mean is (i think), are people here in the UK wanting psychological / social support and not getting it cos of money / the way healthcare here is set up, or are they not wanting it DUE to the way the healthcare system is set up (medical model)?
      Or not wanting it cos they want a 'quick' (easy) fix? Or beacuse they don't want to spend time and effort examining themselves with a therapist?

      I'm not sure that makes sense actually.... in simpler terms - why do you think people don't want psychological support?
      Yes - it all makes sense. Everything you said - It's the cultural conditioning. I don't think it's about money - not when the West spends 40 Billion Dollars a year on psychiatric drugs (120 Billion Dollars on all pharmaceuticals). I think it would take a paradigm shift.

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      Senior Member TheRedStar's Avatar
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      When you see doctors using pens and notes featuring the names of medications, it's not difficult to understand why pharmaceutical approaches are so prevalent...

      Forgive my cynicism, as I know it's more than that. I'm caused to think about my last appointment with a GP, only last Thursday... she seems really nice, and seems to genuinely care, but the way she spoke about my brain chemistry made me realise that she has absolute faith in that approach to mental illness (well, depression anyway...), absolute belief in that hypothesis.

      As do many doctors, and this is where the concept of choice becomes problematic. After all, doctor knows best, right? I think, in many cases, in the eyes of the professionals it's not about patients having a different - but equal - belief system regarding their condition; it's about the ignorant refusing to listen to science, to reason, to experts. My mother, who has Agoraphobia, has been on the receiving end of this - she refused to take medication on the basis that it made her physically sick, and so her doctor refused to treat her at all. Her 'choice' was the doctor's way, or no way - the justification was that the drugs 'soften someone up' and make psychological treatment more likely to work (personally that sounded to me like the kind of thing done in military prisons prior to brainwashing...), and so because it was deemed that she wasn't willing to do what it took to maximise the effectiveness of therapy, the doctor was unwilling to provide that therapy.

      Choice is also difficult in a practical sense... unless you're sitting on money, those too sick to work need some kind of income, which means benefits. And to receive benefits, you need to play ball with the authorities, which means doing what the doctors tell you...

      I do think it is about money... medication isn't cheap, but neither is training and paying the wages of an army of different types of therapists. As such, I think the prevalence of CBT as a first-line therapy for practically everything has as much to do with how relatively cheap and easy it is to provide as with its apparent efficacy - hell, I believe it's started to be offered online now... you can't do that with psychotherapy!

      However, I also think it's about practicality, and indeed about public perception... like it or not, a pill is pretty much the one thing that can be offered on the spot, and enough people believe in Western science, believe sufficiently in the concept of everything having a physical cause - even mental illness - that being prescribed something, anything, can actually be enough in a lot of low-level cases; the placebo effect at work.
      “I took my morning walk, I took my evening walk, I ate something, I thought about something, I wrote something, I napped and dreamt something too, and with all that something, I still have nothing because so much of sum’things has always been and always will be you.

      I miss you."
      - from 'House of Leaves', by Mark Z. Danielewski
      Thanks Starless, pepecat gave thanks for this post

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